I have many questions about dog foods and every where that I look leads me in a different direction. I was wondering if anyone has any unbiased (that mean is not being told by .....to promote their food) opinions. I have an 8 month old lab cross and an 9 week old lab. My vet recommended science diet, pro plan, and Iams. I started with Iams but then my lab cross would not eat it, drank twice as much water as he should have and have inconsistent stools. Plus with the news about Iams I was not too please, So I decieded to change. I had heard that the quality of Iams is better than science diet and ProPlan So I decided to go up a notch and I got Nutro. The lab cross likes Nutro but now he has a dull coat and dandruff. His stools are now consistent. The new pup has smells really bad, including horrible gas and has bright yellow soft stools. I'm not sure where to go next I have had people tell me that Nutro is one of the best and if that is the case I don't know what to do. I have also heard things about raw diets and that they are excellent for dogs. But that is about all I know about raw diets. I just want the best for my dogs and me. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
But those all have corn in them and my dog, as well as many other dogs, has an allergy reaction to it. Every kind of food that I can buy in the supermarket has corn it them. Nurto doesn't have corn, but his coat is dull and has dandruff. Most of the foods at pet stores do not have corn.
Science diet, iams and eukanuba are all mediocre foods. Most foods in petstores like Petsmart do contain high grain contents.
I feed nutro, and have a dog with a silky shiny coat, so I'm not much help there.
I'd suggest if there is a store that sells mainly petfood near you, to look for even better quality dog foods such as Solidgold, Wellness, Flint River, Canidae, Natural Balance, Chicken Soup for A Pup Lover's Soul.
If you look back through the pages on the forum there are a few threads from the past month with great advice on feeding raw. I would if I had the time.
Thank goodness you're savvy enough to blow off posts that make no sense, Koda. =0)
The truths is- it can take a lot of tries before you learn what works well for your dogs- and having multiple dogs makes it even tougher.
You're very right about corn- it's not an ingredient in almost all of the better foods. Nutro is a thorn for me- while their Ultra line isn't a bad food (albeit, extremely overpriced!)- their Max and Natural Choice lines are $$ crap and slightly better $$ crap, IMHO. I don't like the philosophy of a company who puts out varying qualities of food- on one end, they're trying to promote a line as the BEST for your dog (because they know so much about nutrition!) and on the other- they're saying, "Eh. We don't put this junk in our best line- but just in case you're too cheap to blow all your cash on it, we'll offer THESE lines". Confusing, no?
I've tried close to EVERY kibble out there- in addition to raw feeding. Feeding raw is NOT a good idea before lots and lots and lots of research. I personally believe it's the best way to feed most dogs- but I also believe that a good kibble diet can be just fine.
Some of the better kibbles worth looking at: Wellness (my guys are on Super5 Chicken right now) Natural Balance (a universally good, affordable food- few dogs won't like or do well on the Ultra[ie:regular] formula) Canidae Innova (particularly EVO)- but VERY rich (expect soft stools for a few weeks) Chicken Soup For the Dog Lover's Soul Solid Gold Wysong
Thanks longdog I really appriciate your help as well as everyone elses. It seems that the educated people are telling me very simular foods. So I will try switching to one of those. Again thanks so much for all your help!
i feed my 9 week old GSD Merrick canned food and i mix it with Evolve puppy dry food.Its a bit more pricey (1.69 a can) , but he loves is and it has no by products in it , and it has actual chinks of chken and real peas (that you can see). Very good stuff. He was so finicky!!! But now he cleans out his bowl in a matter of minutes.
Holistic feed is the way to go! of course if money is not an issue.
All those commercial brands, use the meat from the 4D's (dead, diseased, decaying , and dying) I would never feed my dog that !!!!! Thats why dogs die so young!
My family had a GSD that lived to be 16 yrs old and he has never ate dog food. He ate boiled chicken with steamed or fresh veggies, fruits etc.., anything else we ate and we gave him vitamins obviously. he never had arthritis, any kind of dysplasia, and was healthy until about 16 years of age until he got hit by a car and died.
So I believe that all the non-human grade food make our dogs die younger and faster than they are supposed to.
Chicken Soup is what I use with my Chi. My Dane has allergies (I am almost positive) so I am about to switch him to that and see how he does. But my Chi likes it and it has really good ingredients. They sell it at PetCo. if you can't find it.
Science diet/Hills is the leader in pet nutrition, all their research, is published for all(pet food manufactors) to see, all the other pet food companies have access to this information, and this is were all pet foods originate/to create there own foods. So really all the other are generic. When you work with animals for a living (sometimes) you see the animals and their conditions on certain brands of foods. Purina is not the greatest choice, but better than kibbles and bits. You really need to try a few, I would love to just tell you which one to feed but, Many poeple have different opinions.And I guess it really comes down to money for some.
Once again, Sue- I just DON'T understand where you're getting your information from.
Hill's is not the only petfood manufacturer researching petfood, nor are they the first or the best. The better companies don't turn to Hill's (or Iams or Pedigree or Purina or any other company) for nutritional information- that's absolutely preposterous.
Science Diet's commercial foods are some of the CHEAPEST to manufacture (THAT, my dear- is where all that "research" comes in) and are of very low quality. Please don’t make me cut and paste my old post again.
We've gone around the tree with this one too many times now. It really would be great if you’d do some research before touting Hill's as a fantastic food again. Save us all a few headaches! You obviously are an intelligent person- so PLEASE back up your comments with facts. Explain to us why Hill’s chooses the low quality fillers, poor sources of protein, dangerous preservatives, and highly allergenic ingredients for their foods.
You’re really beginning to sound like someone with an investment with the company. :0[
I didn't make up the information? Perhaps you should look more into it, and why are you commenting on it? If you choose a different foods go ahead and make your own choices. Perhaps you should contact the company that makes your favourite brand of food and ask them if they guarrantee the food. I've done my reading and research and found the info.Not on the web but here at work every day, for the past 17 years. Client pets, My pets are my investments, If I truely didn't think that the food was complete and was an investment I wouldn't feed it to my dogs. I have other favourites as well, Medi-cal is also a great line. The Medical journals that are distributed have alot of medical research in them, from the Hills company as well, is that all a scam,Where do you think the lamb and rice fad came from? How come there are people that promote Pedigree or Purina? Why, what is the reason, is there a reason? or is the bag just so pretty, or mabe their dog is on the front cover. The corn thing is really gotten out of hand.Why was there a web site on the topic, not everything you see on the net is true. .Ok I'm going to say it.. Alot of those holistic so called brands are pathetic, People see the fancy bag and they buy it? I know because I ask people why they chose certain types of foods."well I've heard from Mary the lady down the street thats its great, and the bag is beautiful" WHAT! My female dog was haveing a bad year, a few years ago now, so a decided to switch to a so called holistic brand, actually got it through work, I don't know what was in it but she dragged herself on the carpet for a few days, till I smacked myself and put her back on the B/D (which is Hills) Shes also been on Medi-cal, but medi-cal wasn't as active in the research department. I know that some people have their own food that they love and totally support. But if someone really wants a diet that they can put their dog on and be sure that every nutritional aspect was covered, I'd say Hills, Iams,Eukanuba & Medical. I'm only interested in the animals health, now and in the future. Spend money on your dog, not on medical bills.If your pet eats unbalanced, hes likely to get sick more often, or look unhealthy. If you disagree, write what you would recommend, don't attack, you sound so threatened, I guess when you don't know, that produces a fear reaction.
Oh and by the way, One of our clients is the president of Nutro dog food, he used to feed his dogs this food but was concerned because both dogs developed dull and itchy skin and coat. They are both only 6 months, and already the coat is showing the damage.
Georgie is on Nutro puppy food and everyone comments on how shiny her coat is. That being said, I have read enough here to try Wellness or something similar once I switch to an adult dog food. I was going to try Innova Evo but my husband will have a fit it she has soft stools. Georgie is trained to go on wee pads and we have to pick up after her.
Sue, once again- I’m sorry to inform you that your “education” has been extremely biased. Vets offices are a great place to observe the damage a bad diet creates- I agree with you on that fact, completely. But dogs doing well on a healthy diet aren't at the vet's office for PROBLEMS very often.
It's sad that the majority of vets don't know more about nutrition- they'd put a dog on a prescription food to deal with symptoms rather than change the dog's diet to something that eliminated the condition!
Prescription foods have their place- and I am a fan of Hill's prescription i/d and g/d canned foods for digestive troubles. They serve to treat SYMPTOMS- not the underlying condition, however. Hill's has made strides in their prescription lines- but many of them are still poor quality foods that can be dangerous over time.
I have shared the reasons that their commercial foods are a poor choice for health. Simply stating "they're healthy because the company has done research" is a very poor defense of the foods! If you want to recommend foods- PLEASE tell us WHY they're healthy. You've demonstrated NO nutritional knowledge yet- you're simply spouting the same advertising goop that a nutritionally ignorant vet does.
You don't know WHY your dog was "scooting"? What "holistic" food were you using? You gave up- after a few DAYS? It takes 1-2 weeks just to integrate a dog to a new food- and another 2-3 weeks before you can make an observation. This statement ALONE demonstrates a severe lacking in your knowledge.
A healthy diet is the best investment one can put towards their pet's health- now and future. Feeding a diet with chemical preservatives banned in most developed countries (and from human consumption in the US)- which have been definitively linked (yup, through scientific research and laboratory testing**) to cancers and renal disorders is NOT a good plan for your pet's lifelong health. Nor is feeding a food based on allergenic fillers.
An interesting development? Hill's Science Diet's *newest* innovation? A "natural" or "holistic" food line! LOL! http://naturesbest.sciencediet.com/more/index.asp Interesting reading- really. Note what they say about the use of chemical preservatives- and the page that demonstrates most CLEARLY why Hill's decided to create this line:
"The "natural" trend is growing at a healthy rate and is here to stay." In other words: We're making this food because it will make us MONEY.
I'm far from threatened, Sue- I have nothing vested in the petfood industry. Why would I be? I choose my dog's foods based on the quality of the ingredients, the method used to preserve those ingredients, the lack of fillers and artificial flavors and colors, and OBSERVATION. Not by the "pretty" package. ROFL!
This isn't an attack- I have a great deal of respect for your opinions on other topics. But you've YET to demonstrate even an iota of valid reasoning for your recommendations.
Try this- you've admitted that Kibbles 'n Bits is a crappy food. Why? And what makes *it* so different from Science Diets commercial lines? :)
Look at the first 4 ingredients - corn meal, chicken by-product, corn gluten meal and dried beet pulp. Dogs get very little benefit from corn and they don't process it well. All dried beet pulp does is harden the stool and nothing more. Chicken by-product is a meal derived from “parts” of a chicken.
Then you have BHT and BHA that are both rarely used in dog foods because they have been shown to be the cause of certain cancers. Hill’s is one of the few that have not seen the light and continue to use them as preservatives.
Vets will continue to supply this food for a couple of reasons. One they get a kick back, and two, most vets know very little about nutrition because surprisingly, they receive no classes on pet nutrition in school.
Hope this shed some light on Hill's.
***Edited By: halo611 on 4/2/2005 9:43:43 PM*** Reason: edit
Hi, I just want to jump in here and not get attacked please!!
I have had VERY similair problems with my Weim for the past 9 months. It was to a point that our vet had him on medications, because his stool was always runny. We tried Nutro, and Iams, you name it!! .....come to find out, he was allergic to almost every brand of food avaliable to him! You name it, he was allergic. So we kept doing "trial and error." Not one name brand high quality food did the trick, nor did foods like Canidae. Not even The science Diet I.D. did the trick.
We FINALLY just recently had HUGE success, and solved our problem with Science Diet; Venison and Potato.
I don't know it that will work for you, but I thought I'd share our adventures, yours were too similair! Good luck to you!
Nobody should attacke you for sharing your experiences, Weim. I just want to point out that your dog is allergic to INGREDIENTS- not foods. It sounds like he may have some protein allergies- not very uncommon.
There are many foods designed for dogs with protein allergies- and they're all outside the range of foods you name. Natural Balance has a Venison and Potato formula that would likely work just FINE for your dog- as would Whitefish formulas from Natural Balance and Wellness, or one of Innova's EVO foods, perhaps even a Duck/Potato food.
Vets are usually quite frustrated when it comes to feeding issues- and tend to turn to the companies they know best (the foods whose makers funded their classes and wrote their texts). Most vets wouldn't have a clue where you can get premium foods- or that so many are available!
Unfortunately for the patient and their owner, these prescription foods they turn to are less nutritive and much more expensive than the healthier foods they can buy outside the vet's office. Instead of addressing the issue as "my dog has allergies"- it should be "my dog is allergic to #####". If you know your dog's allergies, you can move away from the prescription foods easily.
I am a little confused, though- was your vet actively working with you when you tried "all those foods like Canidae" and such? Food trials done correctly work with single protein foods (which Canidae is NOT- with 4 meat protiens), and a vet who suggested that to you raises my eyebrows, to say the least. :-o
With my 5 (3 here, 2 soon to be here), there are protein allergies (Lamb, Venison [yup!], Beef) and grain allergies (Corn products, Soy- and we're beginning to think one of the pack may be harboring a Wheat Allergy). So we look for foods that don't include those ingredients. We have plenty of healthy foods to choose from. :)
Thanks for sharing your experiences- they're proof that not all foods work for all dogs- and sometimes the trials can take quite awhile before a solution is found. Patience is key.