***Edited By: Kodas Mom on 6/28/2006 6:24:37 AM*** Reason: Not interested in dealing with a website that consists such assholes. Thanks, but no thanks. For those of you that deem yourself so knowledgeable....there are many doodle breeders out there that are only breeding doodles...doodle to doodle. I hope you never have the opportunity to embrace one of these incredible creatures. And you say no purpose? The original purpose was produce a dog capable of aiding the disabled unable to have a dog because they were allergic. Sorry for your attitude. It must suck to be you.
THANKS! I will definitely let her know that. This seems like an awesome website and a great way to advertise litters. I will check for myself right now. Do you think it would be better to advertise under Golden Retrievers or Poodles?
Kodas Mom, I'm sorry to happen to be on when your post came up, beings this is your first post and all, But don't you think your friend should have thought of having buyers before even breeding. As for being in Colorado competing with the puppy farms, I'm sorry to tell you, but she is part of the puppy farm. Half price ??? Good, it's good to hear that a purposely mixed breeding is selling cheaply. Does she require a spay/neuter contract with her puppies? or is she just going to make it probable that someone else just as responsible will be breeding also.
Sorry, to flame your post but I cannot support your need to help your friend. I hope the puppies all find great homes and then get fixed.
I am sorry that you are on as well. I happen to be an animal rescuer and disagree with adding to the K-9 population...HOWEVER...there is such a thing as responsible breeders. Those trying to breed healthy animals in a healthy environment. It is not people like her nor myself that is creating the problem of overpopulation. It is the irresponsible people who do not get their animals spade/nuetered letting thier animals impregnate as they want. There are also some folks who will only buy a well bred, pedigreed dog. Not everybody is willing to adopt to save a life.
If you are implying that she is breeding mutts, then you clearly don't know anything about the K-9 world. Every breed at one point has been a "mutt". The doodles are just the next breed of dogs to be recognized. I for one would rather responsible breeders, breeding healthy dogs with good temperments be doing this than every Tom, Dick, & Harry. Hence the importance of our country enforcing breeding licenses and kennel inspections.
I have been personally responsible for saving 1000's of lives over the years as well as getting abusive puppy mills shut down. Not to mention the fundraiser I just did and raised 20k to help a local shelter here in town.
I have every right to help my friend.
I am very offended by your remarks as you know absolutely nothing about me nor my beliefs. Maybe you should think before you speak.
The doodles are just the next breed of dogs to be recognized.------------------------------- -------------------------------------------- Not in our lifetime will a reputable registry be recognizing them.
It is not people like her nor myself that is creating the problem of overpopulation. It is the irresponsible people who do not get their animals spade/nuetered letting thier animals impregnate as they want. -------------------------------------------------- Sounds like contribution to me.
Anyway as of the original question....I have seen some sites that have a category for particular mixes that can be used, or you can use either of the main breeds of the mix. Some sites will bring up that breed as well as any mixes of that breed with the search.
Golden retriever poodle cross breed dogs are not pedigreed dogs, sorry, and while all purebred dogs may have once been mutts, name one that is a cross of only 2 breeds and was developed for no real reason. Sorry but anyone who breeds dogs withotut the intent on improving the breed is contributing to pet overpopulation, that includes mutt and purebred breeders alike.
There is no way that a doodle will ever be regestered by a reputable regestry, for one bery few poodle cross breeds are past an f1 generation, to even be considered a purebred dog it has to have an actual pedegree made up of dogs of the same breed, not a golden poodle cross here and a poodle there and a golden throwen in somewhere else.
Add to that that the truely great Poodle and Golden Retriever, Labrador Retriever, German Shepherd, Doberman Pinscers and what ever other breeds these mutt breeders choose to ruin with their cross breeding, would never sell one for this purpose, the dogs being used for the breeding are low quality dogs, they will never be a good healthy "breed" of dog.
***Edited By: ruffian on 6/28/2006 2:38:55 AM*** Reason: sp
Personally....I think you should do what you feel is right. If you want to work towards making doodles a registered breed...then do it. I agree...all dogs at one point were mutts and it has become so political that now there are rules and regulations outlining what dog should be deemed "a mutt" and "a purebred" or what ever. IMO we have to many "up tight" folks out there promoting and defending purebreeds and condemming those that chose to breed on there own. But that's how it all started in the first place.
As long as you are doing it with the understanding of the overpopulation of dogs/puppies and puppy mills......then I say, go for it.
I personally don't have a problem with people crossing breeds or trying to create a specific cross...to me it's more important how they treat them and the conditions in which they are living. And it doesn't hurt to have potential buyers before breeding.
To me...there are way to many people out there trying to control breeding (purebreeds only), forcing spaying/neutering on people, charging to much for puppies, and other crazy things...We don't go around telling humans about there breeding habits....not to cross and so forth. BLks get "breed" with Whts, Indian w/Korean, Irish w/German....and look what a wonderful variety of people we have on this planet....an array of color and differences. Why can't we have that in the K9 world. If we can't tell people how to "reproduce" then don't think we'll ever be able to legally tell people how and how not to breed there dogs.
After all, at the end of the day, they're only animals.
***Edited By: GotHusky2 on 6/28/2006 9:57:34 AM*** Reason: opps
I agree...there are to many children in shelters...but the point is...that is never going to change. Why? Because you can't tell people what to do without violating there rights...whether it be with human or K9. People are going to do what they want. Sad but true.
People have babies all the time without getting tested. Did any of you get all the test done that are out there before having you kids? Did you filter out the best "mate" for you and that would produce the best "baby"? Probably not...most people don't. And it's the same with K9s. If we did that as humans, maybe we could have breed out alot the diseases and health issues.
People want what they want...and there will always be someone out there to give it to them. I personally own to "purebreed" dogs, but I also know that they're over priced and merely "mutts" overall, because various breeds of dogs were breed just to create them. It's not like we had 100s of breeds of dogs running around this planet from day one. They were created through cross breeding. Same thing people are doing today to get Doodles, Puggles, etc.
I'm not saying I agree or disagree...I'm just saying Live and Let Live. Nobody is going to tell me who I can and can't "breed" with....and they sure as hell aren't going to tell me what I can do with my dogs either. I paid way to much money for them to let someone else tell me what to do with them.
I have no intentions of breeding...I own two males, but if I did, I would. I would research as much as possible, talk it over with vets and other breeders, (just like I did when I was pregnant), and then give it a shot. (Although this is highly unlikely, because I don't have the kind of time necessary to raise pups)...but the point is...if someone has the time and passion to breed and make sure they're properly homed...then who are we to stop them.
And yes I know there are thousands of dogs in pounds and shelters all across the world...but shelter dogs aren't for everyone. Nor are orphans...hence why people have there own children instead of adopting.
I hear so many of you arguing..."Adopt from a shelter, spay/neuter your dog"....but I bet most of you had your own children and didn't adopt and most likely didn't get yourself altered after that.
Gothusky the difference is that WE created dog breeds as they existed today. We are already controlling their breeding. The dogs didn't randomly intermingle to make a 'protodog'. The dogs that breed nowdays aren't having offspring because they are falling in love, or in lust, or whatever the way humans are. They are breeding (ideally anyway) because they are allowed to by the humans that own them, and we most certainly already will "ever be able to legally tell people how and how not to breed there dogs." I can't believe you would make a such a ridiculous comparison.
If dogs had their way the females would have two litters a year and male dogs would roam all over and get into fights and mate with any female that went into heat anywhere any time. And the pet overpopulation problem would be about a gazillion times worse than it already is. Is that what you'd prefer?
Minniyar I'm not saying that dogs should be aloud to roam free and "have there way"....your misunderstanding what I'm saying. I'm saying that if an breeder or a person looking into breeding wants to "cross breed" there dogs to create a new breed....why not. There is a large market out there for these new breeds. As long as they are caring properly for the dogs and making sure they have adequate care. You know, do there research and consult there vet.....why not.
There's people out there that want them...and it's better to have an educated "breeder" provide the "cross breed" for them, then some puppymill.
I see Doodles and Puggles all around my neighborhood...personally they're not for me, but obviously lots of people like them. So why not make sure that they're coming from people that have the pups best interest in mind, then from a puppymiller that is simply "seeing a need, and filling it".
And my point about humans and K9's was simply to show the mentality that is out there. Most people extend what they do with themselves and how they live there lives onto there pets. So if they don't do "testing" for themselves, and tend to be a "lets just see how it turns out" kind of person, then most likely that's how they will be with most things...including breeding.
I think that where we are differing (besides your ridiculous comparision of humans having children being like dogs breeding and having puppies), is that 95% of the time people who are breeding these mixes do NOT have the best interest of the puppies in mind. All most of them have in mind is the almighty dollar.
They see that pet stores are selling a mixed breed dog for $1000+ and wonder why they can't do the same and earn the big bucks. So they breed two dogs of different breeds that happen to be conveniently located. The neighbor's pug with their beagle. Their poodle with the neighbor's doberman. There's no pedigree research into heatlh problems that have been in the breeding dogs, no care about the health of the dogs being bred outside a cursory trip to the vet. They aren't doing health testing and certification. They don't care about creating a breed because, again, all but a handful of them are breeding 1 purebred dog to a different purebred dog for what? Oh yes, money. Once they get their money most of them could give a rip about the health and care of the dog once it leaves their possession, even though it was because of their decision to breed the dogs in teh first place that the puppies were even brought into the world. They don't feel a lifelong connection or responsibility for these puppies the way a responsible breeder would.
And that is NOT how you create a new breed. Yes, all purebred dogs started out as mixes, but after years and generations of careful and selective breeding and record keeping, they breed true. That's why when you breed a doberman pinscher ot a doberman pinscher, you get a puppy that grows up to look like a doberman pinscher. It doesn't look like the breeds that were used to create the dobe breed, like the black english greyhound, or the german pinscher. THAT is what makes them a breed.
Mixed breed dogs, including puggles, goldendoodles, even the cock-a-poo which has been bred since 1967 are mutts, and will never be purebred, because there's no rhyme or reason to the breeding of these dogs. All there is is the continual combinations of two different purebred dogs. There is no selective breeding and careful record keeping and reserach. Every single time they add a new purebred dog to the mixing of the f2+ generations, they set the breeding program back to square one. Thus, these dogs will NEVER be purebred, because they will never breed true. That's what makes a purebred.
I respect your opinon of my "human & K9" comment....but I still think that when it comes to "reproduction" they are two in the same. Pre-testing and research into the parents "history" and so forth can be deemed necessary for both. Maybe I'm not typing it the way I'm thinking it (which is really hard by the way, since I'm tyring to say it in as few words as I can). But in both cases, testing and so forth is overlooked.
As for the purebred...mutt thing.......To each his own. My only concern is whether or not these animals are recieving good care and are in loving homes. You can test all you want and give health guarentees, but the dog can still develop cancer, or other problems somewhere along the lines.
I don't lean either way...there are way to many other things in this world to worry about then whether a dog is purebred or not. To me its..whether or not it's good with children, other dogs, behaves, and makes a great family pet.