Sorry, didn't mean to get off topic! Just want you all to know that we are responsible dog owners! We are not the type to see a cute puppy, buy it on a whim and then, a year or two later drop it off at a shelter. We are the opposite of that! If we could just get a dog to LIVE longer than 6 years we would be happy!
maywoo, your comments are very helpful, thanks. I am making a list of pros and cons now, thanks to all of you!
all of the goldedoodles we see have a wiry looking hair coat , much like a terrier type coat. it doesnt feel like a terrier's coarse coat but it looks like one. none of them have had curly hair like the poodle or the long beautiful coat of the golden retreiver. we have been seeing an increase in serious health problems with them recently. not to mention serious behavioral issues like being skittish, biting, growling etc. not all of them mind you, but an alarming amount of it. enough of it to suspect it is not an owner problem but a "breed" ( and i use that term loosely ) problem.
there are many other low shed breeds out there if that is a deciding factor for you.
I have a wire haired fox terrier and two mini schnauzers. Both breeds are low shedding and are good for those with allergies. I love my terrier but she can be extremly bull headed at times, the schnauzers, although puppies still are much easier going. All three are great with kids and were easy to crate train and house break. That said, my neighbor has a black "goldendoodle" and he is very sweet, loves everyone, but he has terrible ear infections and sheds like a golden. He is a good dog, but he is not the sharpest knife in the drawer (quote by my neighbor, not me).
My parents owned goldens when I was a child and the breed has changed. Our dogs were about 60 pounds, very muscled and small boned. They were water retrievers first, pets second. Great with kids, they obeyed my Dad without question. Wonderful, wonderful dogs. I still miss Peter, who was pts in 1978.
I have had Standard Poodles since 1987. They are harder to train because they are "smarter". This only means that they are more adaptable and will not give up on a problem that interests them. It is this interest factor that you have to work with in training--they are easily bored.
However, the long nose and poodly coat can be overcome if you want a Standard. You just grow hair over the face and have a groomer shape the hair however you want it.
I had a poodle client when I was a groomer whose head was trimmed much like a Bedlington and coat was trimmed back with a ten blade so almost no curl was evident. This dog's human family wanted the temperment of a poodle, without the appearance, and I was able to give it to them.
Poodles and Goldens are both wonderful, wonderful dogs--for different reasons.
From what you said in your original post, I think that you should get the Golden and a Dyson vacuum. If your husband is opposed to hair, have him use the vacuum and keep the dog out of your bedroom (good luck on that one!).
Just stay away from the hybrids. They are turning up more and more in rescue, which should tell you something.
The only thing "scientific" the breeders of doodles and poos is the surgical removal of the cash from your pocket into theirs. There is absolutely nothing scientific about breeding two purebreds, coming up with a mixed breed dog (which is not a hybrid, by the way) and calling it a cutsie name. There are more than a couple purebred dogs that are low shedders. Don't encourage unscrupulous money grubbers by falling for their line of bullcrap.
Did either of you know anyone who had a Portugese Water Dog or an Otterhound? There are good reasons that they are less popular breeds.
Although wonderful for the right owner, neither is an easy keeper. They are hunting breeds and need a "job" and access to water. Look at akc.org before you start recommending breeds you know nothing about.
"Although wonderful for the right owner, neither is an easy keeper. They are hunting breeds and need a "job" and access to water. Look at akc.org before you start recommending breeds you know nothing about."
Perhaps this person shouldn't own a dog then...because working dog or not, a dog requires a LOT of attention...
Suggesting doesn't mean they will go right out and buy them...so there's nothing wrong with it. Giving them PUREBREDS to think about is hopefully prompting them to research the breeds.
Hollygirl, I have a 12wk old SCWT and I also did a lot of research, they have hair and not fur, nonshedding and are hypoallergenic. My pup is doing wonderful with housetraining. I use the crate training and she has not had one accident since using the crate training. I schedule her for eating and bathroom and playtime and then cratetime. Wheatens are incredibly smart, although they are terrier and can be stubborn, but with patience and obedience they are wonderful. Look up Soft Coated Wheaten Terrier puppy because they look totally different than they do as adults. If you have the time to train then they can be trained. good luck with your choices..
***Edited By: Quinnsmom on 10/19/2006 3:30:37 PM*** Reason: ?
<<<Did either of you know anyone who had a Portugese Water Dog or an Otterhound? There are good reasons that they are less popular breeds. >>>
Considering the fact that I worked at a Portie kennel while in college....
The "good reasons" are simply that their coat is mroe difficult to upkeep then say, a standard poodle, and they have quite a bit of energy. But Labs are high energy, Poodles have a difficult coat to maintain what's wrong with a Portie?
If you must have one of these mix breeds go to you local shelter or even rescue groups. There are lots of labrador/poodle crooses there. You can then judge for yourself the shedding which they do shed......& you can have a better judgement of the temperment. Please don't pad the millers wallet. That's is all they care about!
Long ago we had a golden retriever who was pts at 11 with stomach cancer. Our golden was smart and loyal, but he shedded terribly and also had a lifetime of skin rashes, hot spots, and health issues from the time that he was a puppy. We found out early that had had been the product of poor breeding. After his death we waited 10 or so years to get another pet... and in the meantime our daughter was born with allergies.
We initially researched all sorts of breeds, and considered the portugese water dog and the standard poodle. Frankly, while we liked much about the PWD, their cost, their "mouthyness" and the fact that they were prone to be destructive, and the fact than every one alive today can be traced back to a tiny gene pool of 250 dogs just 30 years ago made us VERY nervious of potential health issues.
We liked the standard poodles temperment and intelligence and the fact that they are actually a working dog, but we did not like how skinny they appeared -- perhaps too frail for our rough youngest child.
We eventually located a Canadian breeder who was breeding goldendoodles. They had been breeding field-champion golden retrievers (and their own children, lol) for decades. About 5 years before they added 2 champion female poodles to their family. We met with them, and quickly determined that their goldendoodles were the PERFECT addition to our family! He was house trained in a few days (had only 1 accident!), and understood the invisible fence in about a week at the age of about 6 months. Our goldendoodle is now 6 and weighs about 65 very muscular pounds, and demonstrates all of the loyalty and intelligence of a golden retriever and standard poodle, but without the shedding or allergy problems of a golden or potential "yappiness" of some pooples. :) He loves attention, is the PERFECT family pet, enjoys the activity of our 2 children, but is happy to walk with us every night (with OR without a leash) and is quick to snuggle with us at night watching TV. He is also the PERFECT watch dog and lets us know anytime someone is outside who does not belong. During the day he is a PERFECT companion to my wife! He has had ZERO health issues to date, and we expect him to live perhaps 10 more happy years! Who could ask for more? Oh yeah, he cost us 1/2 the price of a portugese water dog... and seems a bit more hearty that those too!
Mafiaprincess: For your information, hyrbids are waaaaaaay more healthy and stable than pure breds, and maybe if you had actually done a little research before going a a swearing session you would know that most hybrids outlive so called "champion" pure breds and if you googled "goldendoodle testimonials" you would find nothing but praise and appreciation for this awesome breed. And that's just completely thoughtless what you said about "being in it for the money". Anyone knows that these people could earn a LOT more money being an engineer or model, journalist, whatever, but they choose to spend their time doing something productive with a loving heart, knowing others will be happy with their work. Besides, what's the difference between being an engineer for the money and being a breeder in it for cash? At least being a goldendoodle puppy breeder would have a guaruntee of bringing joy into someones life. Shame on you! Hollygirl: Get a goldendoodle! You're wasting every minute without one!
I get so tried of so-called "purist"s breeders out there who hold so much animosity about designer breeds...just as there are unscrupulous breeders of pure bred dogs, of course there are unscrupulous breeders in this area as well. Personally, I don't understand the inflated price of these breeds, but I also believe many pure bred are ridiculously overpriced as well. And if you want to discuss health issues in dogs...do more research please.
A very disturbing side effect of the AKC, et al...in conjunction with dog shows...is that breeders are encouraged to breed to a "standard". And that standard has evolved so much over the years that for some breeds, these dogs are becoming unrecognizable as the original breed! Not to mention that most are bred to standards that are based almost entirely on appearance...and inbreeding that is not only accepted practice, but widely encouraged in the industry...are producing fewer and fewer bloodlines...bringing about more and more severe health issues in purebreds.
All one has to do to to see this in action is to do a tiny but of research through google. We now have German Shepards that have, because of their standard, become seriously close to lame in their hindquarters! A few breeds can simply no longer have unassisted births because a "standard" has been sought out. And look at the King Charles Cavalier...arguably one of the most beautiful faces of any breed...current estimates of the percentage of them born with a defect that eventually causes their brain to no longer fit within the confines of their skulls, fall between 25 & possibly as much as 80%! I promise, if you have had experience with one of these, it is heartbreaking. And don't forget some of the more flat faced breeds...whose standards have been moving towards a more & more flat face...many can no longer regulate their own body temp because they can't pant enough! They have to be placed upon ice blocks after a show in order to allow photos to take place so they don't die from heat! And when these dogs happen to become winners at a show...guess just how many puppies they sire! Often as many as 30 litters & more before these disorders become apparent & many continue even after being told by vets that they should never be allowed to be used as a Stud again!
If I were to go out and beat a dog in the street to the point of causing the same amount of pain these birth defects can cause these animals, I would be immediately jailed & outcast from most of society. But the system of practices allowed & encouraged in the breeding of "pure" dogs, which we know are causing fewer & more restricted genetic traits that will cause huge pain & suffering in these animals...not to mention their unsuspecting families...those guys are not only not punished, but rewarded financially. Search Boxers & brain tumors...something that used to be very rare, is becoming alarmingly less rare. My 6 yr old boxer suffered that way...it was simply, in my opinion, a crime that should be looked upon similar to that of Michael Vick...it was devasting to both her & me...but because of the money involved in the pure breed system...we choose to live in denial or ignorance. Imagine if we had bred people in such a fashion...we know how many problems arise when we find communities where almost everyone shares the same DNA..it is time to open our eyes & accept that we may well be on our way to bringing about the extinction of some of these breeds!
One more thing...it is also a proven fact that the offspring of 2 different breeds will be healthier than either of the parents bloodlines because of the introduction of different genetic makeup to these puppies. So personally, I pray that these dogs are never approved by the AKC, etc...so we aren't tempted to breed to certain standards. The ideal puppy now is to have the 1st generation of the 2 breeds...or one 1st gen parent bred to a poodle parent. Once they are bred doodle to doodle...then similar health problems to pure breds begin to appear. Start talking to the science & biology of it...and less to the breeder side Anytime we get our knowledge mostly from those who profit the most, we are in trouble. One only has to look at our government to get a glimpse of that type of system in place!