A lady I work with and I were discussing this this morning.
I notice in the news there is a lot of pitbull attacks. Or near incidents. I am just questioning here and want your input, don't want to start anything.
As a pitbull owner (i know those of you on here have very nice pitbulls, and even have them around kids, i think one of you even said you have them as a therapy dog??) how did you research the dogs bloodline and is there a way to know if there was any agressive pitbulls in its background.
Also, is there any way to be sure that your dog does not come from a fighting ring (or any other type of agressive past) background?
I know they are trained to be mean most of the time, but how come ones that have never shown agression, and are very friendly in the past just snap? Is it in their bloodlines?
***Edited By: weimngolden on 8/23/2007 3:21:17 PM*** Reason: ..
I am not a pit bull owner but I think it has alot to do with how people treat their pets or train them to do certain things. My friend had a pit bull for 14 years & he was the nicest dog. He never showed any aggression towards anyone or anything I know of. Im kind of curious to hear some responses from some pit bull owners or from someone who knowes more on this issue...Good Question!
Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened!
My dogs are not mean, infact, the hardest they work is from the couch to the bed and back. But then they are not raised to be mean. They are given plenty of love ad attention and exercised daily.
I don't think an animal will just "snap". Lots of time it is either provoked or teased to death (poked at, rocks, sticks thrown) to cause the animal to snap. There are kids in our neighborhood who constantly pick on certain animals. When that animal gets out and sees those people, what do you think they are going to do first?
In this case, his dogs were chained. I hate chaining any animal, this has been proven to cause certain behavioral problems.
I just purchased an APBT puppy and have done a LOT of research. I've noticed a lot of "attacks" lately, too. One case in point - a 7 y.o. boy was killed and his father attacked a few days ago by their pit bull. Beyond the sensationalist headlines we found out that the dog was chained in the basement and had puppies, which the boy was told not to go near (how many kids do you know are going to just leave puppies and not play with them??) The dog attacked the little boy because he was handling the puppies and attacked the father because he tried to save the little boy. This dog (the female, too) had been chained in this basement for months and not allowed to interact with the family at all because it was "mean". It was only there to pump out puppies for the family to sell. That loss of life was terrible and senseless - and the dog was not to blame, in my opinion. There are many such stories out there. I was afraid of them until I dug more and got some more background. Another thing that surprised me was that not all of the dogs the media called "pit bulls" involved in attacks were APBTs. Some of them were Bull Terriers, Boxers, English Bulldogs, Cane Presarios (sp) and a few other in that family. Another story I found fascinating was of a man who'd gotten bitten by a Labrador (I think it was) that was considered mean and wanted something done about it. His complaint was ignored until he called back a few days later and said that he was bitten by a pit bull... they came right out.
Weimgolden..... I don't know much about bloodlines and whatnot.
BUT... aggression is a part of the breed's history, so even if you could go back a bit, if you went back a bit further you would probably find some aggressive dogs, whether or not they were bred for that.
I know what you are asking, it seems like an impossible question to answer. They have been bred to be animal aggressive, that is just a fact.
I have to say that Jackie, I disagree with you that daily exercise and a nice loving home can get aggressive / dominant tendencies out of an animal. It isn't about "just snapping" it is about certain reactions to certain situations. An animal does not have to be poked, prodded, or even disturbed at all during it's life to be aggressive.
"Always remember that you are absolutely unique. Just like everyone else."
IMO, pit bulls are no different from any other dog as far as attacking and aggression goes. More labradors are put to sleep for biting/attacking than pit bulls every year. Why arent their bloodlines being questioned?
Weim, of everything I have learned on this forum, I think it's the breed of Pit I've learned the most about (well that and something else). There are some really terrific breeders here. OWNERSHIP is everything like with any other breed. Obviously it starts with good breeding, good lines, good pedigree, sound genetics and a breeder that knows what they are doing. I have completely changed the way I feel about this breed of dog and find it disgusting the media focuses on this breed more then any when there is a dog attack.
Riley, I would never say a Lab would not bite, foolish statement, but really it's a LAB MIX for the most part. All dogs bite, we all know that. But putting together different breeds it just open up more problems. I just find it impossible to believe true statistics show a pedigree well bred Lab bites more then some of the other breeds. If I am wrong, I apologize. I've definitely heard horror stories of lab/chow, lab/rot, lab/pit and I am not hardly saying it's the breed they are mixed with, not at all!!! Its combining genetics and not knowing what those genetics are going to do. JMO
Savannah, when I did puppy kindergarten with Jasmine, our trainer who I've been with for over 2yrs (a retired vet and certified animal behavorist) went into a big discussion about pit bulls and bites. She told us the #1 dog PTS yearly at.. I think Cornell, was the lab for biting a human. The #1 dog PTS in our city for biting was the yorkie, believe it or not.
I have nothing against labs, and I'm sure their numbers are high because there are simply more labs than other breeds. I'm more afraid of a cocker or chi than a lab any day.
Anyway, my point being, pit bulls are no more likely to bite than any other breed.
It is usually a numbers game - as a rule, more of anything will tend to produce higher statistics. In the pit bull's case, if you look how long the breed has been around (centuries) and the surging popularity by people who don't understand the breed's history and breed (using the term loosely) them for color or mix them with another breed to produce the powder kegs on legs that we see nowadays (and sell them as a "rare" extension of the breed), it can hardly be a surprise that the dog has garnered a bad reputation. There are a lot of idiots with dogs of all types, as we know - but the idiot who owns a pit bull tends to be a more dangerous idiot.
I have never met a pit bull that was agressive. I have met agressive poodles, chis and one peke that would rather bite ya than look at ya. At the end of the day we raise animals. As much as we call them our furkids, our babies, our kids, they are still animals and will behave like them given the chance. A good owner will make all the difference. but mixes are more unpredictable. IMO
Everyone has a photographic memory. Some just don't have any film.
i have nothing against pitbulls, and sorry if come off that way. i was just wondering what kind of research a person looking into buying one would do to try to weed out the "bad bloodlines" or "agressive behaviors".
sorry if i caused a ruckus here.
I myself am not afraid of pitbulls, actually have never met one for that matter. i was bitten, actually attacked not bitten, by one of my own dogs and it was a siberian husky. so i know other breeds can be agressive and am not entering this conversation blindly.
I've been over this before in another thread but I can't seem to find it
Many dogs are all lumped into the "pit bull" category and also falsly identified in bite reports; many AC and cops wouldn't knwo a real APBT if one was licking their face. That being said there are mnnay irresponsible owners and also irresponsible breeders breeding dogs that should never be in the gene pool of all breeds so of course there are some bad apples.
QUOTE "As a pit bull owner (I know those of you on here have very nice pit bull, and even have them around kids, I think one of you even said you have them as a therapy dog??) "
I have three APBTs that are working certified therapy dogs there are many APBTs working as not only therapy but service dogs :)
QUOTE "how did you research the dogs bloodline and is there a way to know if there was any aggressive pitbulls in its background."
If you go back far enough into any bloodline you will find dogs that were used in the fighting ring because that is what the breed was originally bred for. there are many lines that do not have any fighting dogs up close in their peds especially since fighting dogs has been illegal for quite sometime. As you know however there are underground rings run where it still goes on. Many didn't realize that until the recent Michael Vick case. As for knowing where your particular dog came from if he is a rescue there is no way to tell , if you have a pedigree it is easy enough to research if you got the dog from a reputable breeder.
You can of course also get regular pedigree info from UKC and ADBA if the dog is registered to see what dogs are in his bloodline. There is an online site called onlinpedigrees where you can look up your dog if his ancestors have been listed.
There are many APBT forums with people in the breed for MANY years who are often very helpful in doing pedigree research
None of that however will tell you if your dog will have aggression issues
QUOTE "Also, is there any way to be sure that your dog does not come from a fighting ring (or any other type of aggressive past) background? "
If you are talking about a rescued dog, then no. If you are talking about a dog from a reputable breeder than yes by tracing the bloodline and trusting the breeder.
QUOTE "I know they are trained to be mean most of the time, but how come ones that have never shown aggression, and are very friendly in the past just snap? Is it in their bloodlines?"
There is no such thing as a stable dog just snapping. There are always signs but that owner probably never bothered to take the time to learn about behavior, posture and other dog language. This is often said by owners who include one or more of these types...they do no training , socialization or have no clue about their own dog and or have the dog as an outside only dog IMO
The only time I'd say a dog would snap and something would happen out of absolutely nowhere is if a dog is ill in some way or in pain.
Dog aggression and prey drive may or may not be in any breed of dog.
As for Human aggression that is NEVER to be tolerated in an APBT and even the people who started the breed and used them as fighting dogs culled dogs with human aggression. It is not part of the breed in a true APBT.
People need to really learn about their individual dog and then be a esponsible owner You can not just love and coddle an aggression issue away if a dog has one
Patch O' Pits , Home to Greatly Loved Ch GRCH, Therapy, & Agility APBTs "When it Rains Play in the mud"
Riley: I have heard those statistics as well. Labs are also pretty high on the list for serious attacks. I also agree that I think that has more to do with the Lab being more popular and there are just more out there. Also more being badly bred b/c they are so poplular.
I personally love Labs & Pitbulls. I almost had the chance a year ago to foster a pair of pits when their owner could no longer care for them. It didn't work out though, they were too far away. I don't know what it is, but I am such a sucker for pits the last few years. Probably b/c they are so misunderstood!
I agree with an above post, I am more scared of a cocker spaniel than anything else! Probably b/c I have never known a nice one... it's unfortunate.
The more people I meet, the more I love my Siberians...
Great info Patch.... I kind of consider you the Pit authority on this forum. Or, at least the one I know I can trust anyways. I'm sure there are other great pit owners/breeders on here as well, I just haven't come across them, yet! I hope to!
Edit: Duh, I forgot Jackie! I'm sorry I ignored you, Jackie!
The more people I meet, the more I love my Siberians...
thank you patch. that is kind of what i was asking, and i was not trying to come off as rude or bashing in any way. i just wanted to know some answers. i think you have cleared it up for me, and anyone else whose wandering mind was wondering.
You know I had a roomate that had a pit. Super sweet pooch she really was then one day she chewed apart the other dog. poor thing they had to put her down the damage was so severe. I'd have to say that they an just snap. People do why can't the critters? Not saying that my pointer mix/or my sheperd mix wouldn't do the same thing but then about 3 weeks later the dog tweaked out again and shredded the cat. If that's not snapping what is?
It's just some people raise the dogs wrong like hitting them when they are puppies or like any type of dog can bite Pit Bulls are like any dog some dogs will and others wont its just how the dogs personality is.