I was just wondering why these pups i see on places like puppyfind.com etc are so expensive becuse they are from breeders? is it because they are purebred and they are for show? are all breeders breeding for show dogs or can you find a breeder that is just trying to breed great pups? Some of these prices are really crazy.....just wanted to know. thanks! -Kelly
this is a topic of great debate. asking this may only confuse you. dogs are breed for show,sporting and working ability, and some for temperment. dogs are usually consider more marketable if they are AKC registerable or already registered and if the parents have any competion titles
There's more to it than that. Often times, expensive dogs from a long line of Champions, mother and sire are champions, they'll have a health guarantee. Their parents will be OFAed for hips, elbows, knees, thyroid tested, CERFed as normal for eyes. They may be dna tested as well. All of those tests can cost $1000 or more per dog, andt hats' before the dog is even bred. Not to mention the cost for travelling around and paying money for shows to get the parents their Ch titles. With breeds like bulldogs and the like, there's a good chance the mother dog had to have a c-section, which can cost $1000 to $3000 depending on complications. In addition to these prices, a good breeder takes their pregnant females to the vet regularly and has at least 1 ultrasound done during the pregnancy.. all of these are reflected in the price of the puppy. That is why a GOOD puppy costs so much more. Buying a dog, it isn't a case of cheaper is better. You definitely get what you pay for.
Even if the breeder is breeding for show quality dogs, usually about half the litter turns out to be pet quality. You can buy one of these pet quality dogs for cheaper then the show quality ones. Going to a breeder is much smarter then buying at a pet shop in the newspaper, or at a puppy mill. As was mentioned earlier, you have all the health issues, but also you will 99.9% of the time get better temperment and conformation. Now, you are probably saying, "I don't care about conformation" but if you want your dog to be able to run, and jump, and eat properly, you are going to want good conformation. Pet Shops don't care about the conformation or temperment, they just want the puppies to look cute, and here's a news flash: A puppy from a breeder will be just as cute or cuter then one from a pet store or puppy mill. Also, it will be much easier to house break your dog if it was not bought at a puppy mill or in a pet store, because at these places the puppies live in their own filth, and they don't care if they dirty their home. A good breeder will also stimulate the puppies brains when they are very young, and socialize them when they are about 4 weeks old. When looking for a good pup/breeder, ask to see both parents, and if not that at least the mother, the mother should be completly trustworthy and not skitish, aggersive or shy, even if you are touching her puppies. Both parents and grandparents should be cleared for all hereditary diseases, at least half the dogs in the 4-5 generation pedigree should be titled in conformation, obiediance, agility, or performance, the litter should be AKC/CKC registered (Any other registery is basically for pet shops and puppy mills to say that their dogs are "registered," but they actual have no meaning or worth.) and the place the puppies are kept should be very clean. If you aren't satisfied that any of these requirments are met, find a different breeder. Also, for a pet you should never have to pay over 700-800 dollars, and most pets are 400-600 dollars. A good breeder will also be there for you through the entire dogs life, and you can ask them questions about training and taking care of the dog.
To make it pretty simplistic, I spent a great deal of money on maintaining my pair before any breeding too place. During the pregnancy & nursing, I provided the mother with all the vet/nutritional care one could ask for. I never stopped to consider expense when it came to caring for the pups, vet bills for check ups, wormings, shots, proper food, containement, etc...They received the best of care way before I had received the 1st deposit. I spent money I had no guarantee of having returned because my dam & her pups deserved the best. My pups are guaranteed and I speak with ALL of the owners via e-mail or phone (long distance calls are at my expense) every week or 10 days. One of the new owners is handicapped and needs a cane to walk. Bending over to clean up after a puppy is not the easiest thing in the world. She had a trainer prior to picking up the pup who was to help with the basics. Her trainer backed out on her and after more than after 2 weeks of struggling on her own, I have had her pup here for the last week taking care of housebreaking and crate training him for her. The pups from that litter are as much a lifelong committment to me as are the parents who live with me. Add to that the fact that both parents are from superb bloodlines and you have an idea of why I charged "so much" for my pups~ It certainly wasn't to "get rich quick". All told I had 10 pups. I kept one, I co-own one being groomed for show (for which no money exchanged hands) and I gave one to my oldest daughter and her children as promised. Of the 7 that were "sold", I made MAYBE $2,500 profit for which I stayed up nights for 2 weeks, got up every 2 hours for 3 more and spent endless hours feeding, socailizing and cleaning up after 10 pups until they were 8-10 weeks of age. Let's not overlook the fun I had hauling 10 active pups to the vet for shots, wormings and health certificates, got to be really amusing as they got older and bigger! If you break it down by the amount of work that went in to having perfectly healthy and happy pups, I guess I made somewhere around $2.50- $3.00 an hour for all of the hard work. And that's being generous. Just wanted to put in my perspective from the breeder's point of view. Something I won't be doing again.
I read a comment about dogs being registered with AKC or CKC. I know nothing about CKC. But I have hurd how hard AKC is to deal with. This is yet another reason that pets are so high. I personaly have not had any problems (yet) but I have talked to so many people that will NOT use AKC becaues of all the trouble AKC puts a breeder threw. If you research all of the registeries you will find out that there is one so much like AKC. The American Pet Registery APRI. They go strictly off of AKC stud books. If your dog is not listed with AKC they will not register the dog. APRI is just like AKC with out all of the bull. I have 2 dogs that have AKC parents but the breeders has chosen not to register with AKC. I can not register the dog with AKC even though the parents are AKC the breeder has to get papers for that dog. I have called and offered more money just to get the AKC papers but the breeder has chosen not to register with AKC. So you do the next best thing and go with APRI. Check them out aprpets.org. Thank You great topic.
My litter was registered with the AKC within an hour of birth (which can now be done on-line). I've never had any problems registering my dogs or pups with AKC, so I'm not sure what problems folks are having.
A dog being AKC registered doesn't mean much. It just means their parents were both purebred. If a breeder tries to use AKC registration as the main selling point, I'd be very cautious. Especially if the parents aren't there to be handled.
Count, if you mean me, nope. My breeding pair's pedigree, which is registered with the AKC (as were the pups) was important in determing the value of the pup's heritage and bloodlines. Each pup was "judged" on quality individually. I can trace my pup's heritage back to at least 9 generations (more if I choose to do so for a nominal $10.00 fee). Can those without registrations say the same? HOWEVER you can NOT expect someone to have championship bloodlines, with excellent RECORDED pedigrees to sell their pups at a low cost, simply to sell them off. I would rather have kept my prices where they were and kept any unsold pups. Why devalue the lines they were bred out of? The kennels who have worked so long and hard to establish excellent lines and reputations? Another thing I considered as a breeder was one aspect of human nature. If someone gets something for "bargin" prices, they tend to place it at a lesser value. I'm not saying this is true of everyone, but it IS true for some. You also have to try to make sure you have not only vet refrences, but some reasonable assurances that the new owners will be able to afford proper care of the pet once it's in their home.
The AKC is an exellent organization and if anyone is having a problem with them its for a good reason. You can see who is in good standing and who isn't and why on a website for that, if they have prob with AKC, they are doing something wrong in their recordkeeping or in they way they are breeding. Be careful!!! They do keep an eye on breeders... Melissa....
Melissa, I agree with you 100%. I invested in a computerized Breeder's program to make sure eveything required by the AKC was recorded in a secure form as well as hard copies of all the information. All the records are safely stored in one place in addition to the computerized records. The AKC has the right to request my records or visit my home at any time they choose to do so. All part of my reistering my litter. I, personally, find it reassuring that they actually DO try to maintain records of the quality of the breeders and breeding programs out there.
Oh, I'm not offended. Just trying to clarify the misconceptions that might arise from your statement about breeders using AKC registrations as a selling point. There are MANY factors that go into the "pricing" of pups. AKC registration is one of them, for valid reason. Had I taken offense, I would simply have replied with something along the lines of "Why do breeders charge so much"?..."Because we CAN"! As a matter of fact, I'd really like you to take a peek at my pups and their pedigrees, then give me an idea of what you, had you been the breeder, would have considered a fair price. It's really not easy, honest. http://pyrpups.com
I think by the CKC that guy means the canadian Kennel club and not the continental kennel club. And to whoever said registering with the AKC was difficult and that an APRI registered dog was registered just like a dog with the AKC? That's a flat out lie. No international registry organization (including the Canadian Kennel Club) will accept any other US registry outside of the AKC. The APRI does like 6 shows a year, and I see nothing related to performance events on their site. The AKC does probably 100 shows a month nationwide, and hundreds of performance events as well. I'm not sure how registering a dog wtih the AKC is any more difficult, other than the AKC requires litter registration for breeders so they can keep better records. If people say that registering with the AKC is an effort, they're not putting a lot of effort into it. If your dog can be akc registered, it really SHOULD be AKC registered. The APRI doesn't offer limited registration for dogs. In fact, the APRI website says that if your dog is sold on limited registration with the AKC, you can still register it with them and breed it. That's a clear violation of the intent of an AKC breeder even selling a limited registration dog, which is to keep it out of the breeding pool. In fact, the more I read the APRI website registration information, the more convinced I am that this is a registry created by puppy millers for puppy millers. They register some breeders as a professional breeder.. This is a breeder that has 3 or more breeding females and regularly sells puppys to the 'pet market'. If that doesn't translate into 'pet stores' I am not sure what does. And get this, if you get an APRI registered dog and you havent' met or know the breeder (how else can you do this except by purchasing the dog through a pet store), the APRI will not provide the phone number or even the address of the breeder to you despite the fact that they have it in their records. It says "We gladly contact a breeder when this situation arises, and we ask if he/she will contact the pet owner or if we have permission to release the information. The decision is always the breeder's and we abide by it. The same applies to the pet owner." Here's the URL for the APRI. http://www.aprpets.org/main/index.php That said, you can indeed still register your dog with the AKC Crisy even if the dog's parents aren't registered. All that is required is that the dog be spayed/neutered with proof from a vet, and you provide a picture of the dog.
Silverdust to say that a dog that is registered by anything other then AKC or CKC is not fair. What about the coonhouds and French Brittany that are only registered by UKC or the really rare breeds that are registered with ABRA or FCI. Are you saying these dogs are bad and come from puppy mills, because I have never seen a dog regersted with ABRA or FCI in a pet store. I'm not sure why RuffinMuffin thinks that breeders sell their dogs for so much. Have you checked out prices at pet stores. I mean on any given day you can find the newpapers full of labs for 250 to 300, but you go to the pet shop and they want 600 to 700 for theirs. In most cases the puppy they get from the BYB is going to be better then the one from the store. As for ARPI it is nothing more then a cheaper way for puppy mills and BYB to register their dogs. At least all the pet stores around here have almost all their dogs registered with ARPI. You can hardly find any with AKC papers. Then the puppies with AKC papers are like 100 to 200 more then the ones with APRI which indicates to me that they aren't very good and don't regulate their breeders like AKC does. As for breeders charging so much I charge right in the middle of what my breed goes for. It just that most people want something for nothing. Well if they want a cheap dog they should just go to their nearest shelter or rescue group and get one, but their are people that even think that they charge to much. The way I look at it is do your homework what are you getting for your money. If you are spending 600 on a dog that hasn't had any shots never been to a vet and doesn't show any signs of being socilized then I would say you are being ripped off. Then on the other hand if the dog has been dewormed, all cosmetics done if needed, shots given, vet checked, they are very well socilized and the breeder can give you personal information about the puppy you are interested in then I would say that is a great deal. Some breeds are expensive also because the breed club set the price standard to weed out the BYB and the puppy mill people. Then their are you english bulldogs a lot of they have to have c-sections, but some also have to be AI'd and it is very dangous for this breed to go under antisticia (sp) so the breeders charge a lot to cover all the expenses and to make sure you really want the dog. Which is the third reason some breeds prices are so high. The breeders again don't want the dogs to end up in the wrong hands with people that will over breed it to were it has a lot of genetic problems and temperment problems. Like the cocker spaniel. Just do your homework when buy a dog cheap isn't always the best, but the most expensive isn't always the best either.
Langiappe, what is the ABRA? Do you mean the ARBA, the american rare breed registry? The ARBA is used for foundation stock services for the AKC, it is a good registry that has helped add new breeds to the AKC like the Neopolitan mastiff, the Black Russian terrier and a vast majority of other breeds. Any dog that is FCI registered may as well be AKC registered. The FCI is the international dog registry, and the FCI will only accept registries from the AKC in the US, and the Canadian KEnnel Club in Canada, not from any other organization, including the ARBA and the UKC. It is not a domestic registry so doesnt' really compare with the other registries in the US or in Canada. As I said, if your dog is of a breed that CAN be AKC (or Canadian KC for that matter) registered and you live in the US or Canada, it SHOULD be registered with those. Or it should be registered with an acceptable foreign registry that will allow dual registration in that organization and the AKC/CKC
On setting the prices for your litter, Langniappe brough up another very good point...what price range are the breed clubs setting for that particular breed? I know that Pyrs can be found from about $250.00 to $3,000.00 a WIDE range to say the least. The majority of the reputable breeders for Pyrs price them somewhere between $800 -$1500. with the few rare exceptions on the higher end of the scale. It is not unheard of for breed clubs to snub someone they feel is selling for far lower prices, labeling them as BYBs (true or not). One other point to understand is that some breeders list ALL pups in a litter of AKC registered, but not CH lines as "Pet" quality, sold with limited registrations. I have 2 friends who breed and sell Yorkies in this manner, and charge a flat rate of $800.00 for each male, $1,000.00 for each female. Since their litters are very small, and tey only breed a female every other year, they find a high demand for their pups at these prices and have no trouble placing all of their pups.