LPN, perhaps my wording was a little strong. My point was simply that spay and neuter are not the only way to prevent dog breeding. It just like cropping/docking isn't absolutely neccessary. Don't get me wrong, I support spay/neuter. I agree with Ruffian that a lot of "casual dog owners" that ya'll are describing probably shouldn't own a dog in the first place. The Beagle Razz refered to is an excellent example. I don't doubt that there have been dogs who have gone to great lengths to get to a female in heat, but I believe those are isolated incidences. I also believe dogs are more likely to escape b/c they need mental stimulation that their owners aren't providing. Every intact male isn't going to climb wall or destroy metal fencing, just b/c there is a female in heat nearby. Conversely, neutering doesn't guarantee that a dog will never escape or roam. I also believe that there is more research that needs to be done on the safety of spay neuter, especially early spay neuter in large breeds. Razz, I believe less than one percent of the male dog population suffers from testicular cancer. Testicular cancer is slow growing and the most common treatment is castration. So yes, s/n does prevent testicular cancer, but when vets give that particular reason for having the surgery, they aren't being completely honest.
Don't forget that some breeds, for example, have their tails docked for a reason. I don't show, but my brittanys hunt. Their tails are docked to protect them when they run through briars/brambles/thorns, etc. So you don't necessarily have to be either a "breeder" or "casual pet owner". You may actually own a dog that does what he was bred for.
I don't think anyone mentioned this specifically but I hear a lot of times why should they be docked/cropped if they are just house pets anyway? We have fostered so many dogs over the years-dogs from posh homes were they grew sick of taking care of them and dogs from mills. None of the dogs had a plan that they were going to go live on a farm for a while. In all honestly even the best of breeders have dogs end up in rescue-you don't know were that dog will be in five years so set it up to succeeded.
I consider all my dogs working dogs. Many dogs from rescue get places in homes were they are out on farms and yes I even support hunting dogs. Many do these dogs people had that were "crazy" just want to do what they were bred for.
Another thing which shouldn't count but does is if there are two rotts in my local pound one docked one not- Its the docked one who will get a new home. same with boxers. There was a study on boxer mixes and people choose the dog with the docked tail.
I still would rather see a floppy ear on a dobe that a bad crop,and a tail on a dog vs some hack job. But its not really a black and white issue.
If I have any beliefs about immortality, it is that certain dogs I have known will go to heaven, and very, very few persons -James Thurber
I wanted to add that I think it's great that you breeders have spay/neuter contracts. Like I said before I'm not anti-spay/neuter.
Joce, I have to admit that if I had a choice between a docked and undocked dog, I would choose the docked dog. Call me shallow if you want, but not only do I perfer docked dogs for aesthetic(sp?) reasons, but practical ones as well. This Thanksgiving my brother brought both his pitbull(undocked) and his Standard Poodle(docked). I cleaned up no fewer than five drinks that the pit knocked of my end tables. I seemed as though every time he walked through my living room, something went flying of one of the tables. I also had quite a few bruises on my leg from his very whip like tail, ouch.
I agree with trying to look in a rescue.. Many of the dobies placed in rescue have been/or are being trained in the areas of training and socialization before they are adopted out. Many rescues will even help determine age/gender that would be better suited for your living arrangement as well. Also if you are a first time Dobie owner can help you with any questions you may have.
As far as to crop or not to crop...I grew up with a red with tail and ears done. I don't really remember him having any pain and the tape didn't have to stay on for very long. While growing up whenever we would watch dog shows we would all point the breed out as at would stride by on the TV screen. It was for us, more of a personal prefrence; our family like's a distinguished and polished look of the breed. He was from good lines yet was neutred out of conveince and an inside typical big baby of a family dog who lived out a happy (maybe even a bit spoiled) life. I don't think there is any shame or abuse in any of that.
***Edited By: azynda on 12/22/2008 2:29:53 PM*** Reason: SP
Your best friend may just be a click away "www.petfinder.com"
Any reputble or decent breeder even you find will not be able to accomodate a no tail dock request. I have had this requested of my Min Pins before as well.
Good breeders are breeding for breed improvement and show stock. There is no way of knowing at 3 days of age which puppy will make the grade as a show potential puppy. Due to this, leaving a tail on any random puppy is not an option except for the uncrupulous breeders that you wouldn't want to purchase from anyway.
As a breeder I breed to the standard, therefore I expect each and every puppy to be a perfect match to the standard. Is that likley, no, but at 2 or 3 days old I can't tell that. I can pretty much tell if they are long or short back and that is about it. Although at about 3 to 4 weeks old I can start to see angles I still can not see a good show dog. I takes 4 to 6 months of age before I know if I really have a show puppy or not.
That all said I agree i am going to doc tails and unless I have a puppy sold and a request for naturla ears I am going to crop them as well. I don't let the new owners crop the ears because I know the vet I use is a doberman breeder and know what she is doing with the ears. I also chip all puppies before they leave my place and my name goes on the chip registration as the second contact.
I brought that life into this world and I am responsible for it. I can't help what goes on in the forever home (that I don't know about) after the pup leaves my place but I have turned people away after interviewing them and believing they were not right for one of my babies.