As most of you know, I am new to the dog show world. I have never kept a male intact, hence my question. Summit is now 5 months old. Sierra may or may not have had her first heat (for those of you who haven't heard our 'heat saga'). At what point are males mature enough to want to hump? I have noticed him play mounting Sierra. It's pretty funny, she is sitting down and he tries to hump her! I just want to be vigilant. Both of his testicles are in. We have a way to contain him and her when she does have a heat, so no problem there. I know it is probably different for each male just as a heat cycle is different for each female. I was just hoping to pick your brains a bit! LOL! Thanks in advance!
I have never seen a pup at 6 months be viable. I am certainly not saying it's not possible, just saying I have never seen it or heard of it in my personal experience. At that age it's still dominance and just the beginning of "exploring" the possibilities. Definitely at 6 months, heck even at 2/3 months I see the humping but to answer "viablilty".. not yet. They can get hard too (sorry to be graphic) but again, actually being viable... very rare at that young of age. Let me add I am suggesting that one would have to collect and scope to see if the swimmers are viable or have a "whoops" and a litter with a dog of that age. With my personal boys over the years, yes, I have actually tried to collect and see... what a joke, hilarious actually... naaaaaaaaaaa still a puppy and would rather roll over for a belly rub at that age LOL
9-10 months, different story all together.
What would be interesting is to find out if people with small breeds have had different experiences. I actually do not know if this is something that would be breed specific. Do small breeds sexually develop faster (dogs that is, not bitches)??
My one female went into heat when my two males were 7 months old - they knew what they wanted but at that age they were not strong enough to get her. One of them did get her 7 months later though. I would just see how he reacts when you definately know that she is in heat and keep them seperated at that time - unless you want puppies.
Savannah, personally I agree with you but I have been told by several folks and vets to be careful with them starting at 6 months. Being that we are not wanting unplanned pups I use that as a "on the safe side" guide ;) I will admit that at 4 months I watched my boy attempt to mount his mother but the size difference was so great still that it was really kind of funny. Because of the attempt I kept him away from her when I was not right with them to stop the behavior just in case he found a stool or something, lol. We never know for sure without doing a bunch of testing and even then can't be positive about viability. I tend to go the overly cautious rout (hence my double crate and metal doors in my house, lol) I have herd way to many stories about the Whoops litter from other breeders, who do know better, and want to do everything I can to prevent them. A whoops litter with my stud would be one thing, but a whoops with a mother, son combo - no way! haha. I was so paranoid when my boy was 16months that I sent him to my dads house for the month, lol. Now, I've got it all figured out here at my house so that he can stay with me though ;)
I prefur to have my Bordeaux with fur instead of a cork and bottle ;)
There is an easy simple way to guesstimate if you should worry about a male.
If he lifts his leg while peeing, odds are he is ready and able to do the deed. Since the hormones that trigger this behavior are the same ones that trigger sperm production, it is a pretty good indicator.
If I seem to have a superiority complex, it is because you make it so easy.
Juno I respectfully disagree. My studs on average do not lift their legs until 15-18 months of age. I assure you they can sire litters way before that. And in fact this is one thing unlike my previous posts I can categorically say NO WAY..... I know way too many dogs, in many many breeds that can sire litters before the leg is lifted. Some have 1 stud with all females and they dont ever lift their leg. LOL
I also klnow people who were BYBs that had a male sire a litter at about 6 months :(
I personally don't allow any of mine too play hump as it is asking for a problem not just breeding wise but it can start a fight as it is a sign of dominance.
Quote... "If he lifts his leg while peeing, odds are he is ready and able to do the deed." That is not true. Some males never lift there legs while others like mine start as very very young pups with leg lifting which is a dominance behavior. I have a female that lifts her leg too LOL
Patch O' Pits , Home to Greatly Loved Ch GRCH, Therapy, & Agility APBTs "When it Rains Play in the mud"
patch is backkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk lol@your girl lifting leg.
I still do wonder if over all a small breed dog is more apt to be viable then a large breed at this age.. again, possible and does happen, just asking physically speaking do smaller breeds over all have the ability sooner to stud a litter? HELP SMALL BREEDERS out there LOL ok, rephrase.. breeders of small breeds LOLOLOLOL yikes what's wrong today
Actually Savannah, I think there might be something to the small breed - large breed viability difference. My dogs are well known for their, ummm, horniness (for lack of a better word). I personally know of a 5 month old whoops, and a 6 month old whoops, different breeders, but both Bostons.The 5 month old was closer to 6 but still. I have noticed their sexual maturity seems to be quite quick, as opposed to say Rottie's, or Labs. I'd be interested to know if there is a scientific basis for this, as all I have to go on is my own experience. I know for a fact that I would never dare leave an intact male, 5 months or older anywhere near a bitch in heat, in fact I'm extremely paranoid about any of them, as I have actually seen a neutered 2 1/2 year old male mount and tie with his mother...only tied for about 2 minutes, but tied, none the less. I was shocked. I did'nt think that was possible, but it certainly is. I think I can safely say that the sex drive of these dogs is very high. Beyond that, I don't know if they mature much quicker than other breeds, or not.
Don't worry, WE DO NOT WANT PUPPIES! They are still babies themselves! Maybe in the future.... but now? Now way!
I don't mind if any of my dogs hump when it is play or even dominance. Within our pack fights are very rare even when there is food around. Dominant mounting wouldn't cause a fight here. But I can see how that would be a problem in stronger-willed breeds.
I will definitely keep an eye on them. Like I said, she was completely oblivious and was not receptive at all. He seemed like he was just messing around. Just a little bit of drive, but no idea what do do about it. She is definitely not in heat now, so we may just see a true heat out of her yet! She is a little over 7 months, so we'll see.
My main concern was the fact that we have been putting them in our 'puppy highrise' together while we are gone. Sierra is trained on the fence, but Summit is not. We put them together so they can keep each other company.
I will just continue to be vigilant and keep watch!
huskyseehuskydo, yes I think that makes a lot of sense, at least what I've observed with my breed leads me to the conclusion that they are sexually mature, at a relatively young age. One thing for sure, the next heat cycle your girl has, in 6 months, give or take, your boy will definitely be a danger, but I don't have to tell you that!
OK, the initial thread threw me off. Viable means to be able to sustain life and is when a puppy is born unthrifty, is it viable, can it sustain life. The word referring to a male ability to reproduce is varility. And the age at which a male can develope varility varies from breed to breed as well as dog to dog. My males are quite capable at min. 6 months but would never trust a male at 5 months with a bitch in heat. If the AKC will accept a breeding sired by a male at the age of 7 months, then we know they can start fairly early to produce sperm(which if the sperm is mature enough to produce puppies, then the sperm would be considered viable).
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