I purchased bulldogs from a woman in Alabama that allegedly belonged to the late Karen Fritchen of Troy, Illinois. This party in posession of Karen's Dogs that I purchased them from is unwilling or unable to produce AKC paperwork as promised and refuses to respond to questions. I am requesting that any information about these dogs be posted.
Well, when you purchase a dog, you are supposed to get the papers as soon as you give them the check. No papers, don't buy the dog. It's all over the AKC's "Buying a Dog" section. I am aware that you prolly didn't know that. I am sorry. ---Allie the Chihuahua http://www.dogster.com/?41063 ---Mönica the Kitty http://www.catster.com/?57596
I've never heard of her. Maybe she was on the site but not the discussion board, or maybe her screen name wasn't something that would be recognized. Have you heard back from AKC? Have a good day! Rusty the Golden Retriever http://www.dogster.com/?68489 Bailey the Pug http://www.dogster.com/?68491 Ariel the Chihuahua http://www.dogster.com/?68494 Lady the Greyhound http://www.dogster.com/?78537
Here is a quote from the AKC, if this helps: "Papers and Identification When you buy a dog represented as AKC registerable, you should receive an AKC Dog Registration Application form properly filled out by the seller. When you complete your portion and submit it with the proper fee, this form will enable you to register the dog. When the application has been processed, you will receive an AKC Registration Certificate. Under AKC Rules, any person who sells dogs represented as AKC registerable, must maintain records that make it possible to give full identifying information with every dog delivered even though AKC "papers" are not yet available. Do not accept a promise of later identification. The Rules and Regulations of the American Kennel Club stipulate that whenever someone sells or delivers a dog registerable with AKC, the dog must be identified by providing the buyer with a properly completed AKC Dog Registration Application for a dog not yet individually registered or a properly completed AKC Registration Certificate for a registered dog. If neither of these is available, the person delivering or shipping the dog must furnish the person acquiring the dog with a bill of sale or written statement, signed by the seller, giving all of the identifying information listed below. For a Dog Not Yet Individually Registered Breed Sex and color and markings Date of birth Litter number (when available) Names and numbers of sire and dam Name of breeder Date sold or delivered For a Registered Dog Breed Registered name Registration number Date sold or delivered This identifying information must be supplied with the dog even though AKC papers are not yet available, and even to a person who takes the dog only for resale as an agent or on consignment, and the same information must be passed on by him when he disposes of it. When you do receive the properly completed AKC registration papers, verify the papers against your bill of sale to ensure that all the information is correct. Please be advised that a dog will not be registered or transferred without the proper AKC registration papers. If you are buying a dog that is supposed to be registerable with the AKC you should realize it is your responsibility to obtain complete identification of the dog or you should not buy the dog. Failure to get AKC "registration papers" causes more grief for buyers of pure-bred registerable dogs than any other problem except sickness. It has long been common practice to explain the inability saying "AKC hasn't sent the papers yet." The essence of this and similar excuses is that because the American Kennel Club is at fault, papers are not available. The standard processing time of any AKC registration item is generally only a few days. If a breeder is doing his paperwork in a regular, careful manner, there is ample time to obtain the necessary "papers" from AKC prior to sale of any puppy. When "papers" are not available at the time of delivery, it is a red-flag warning sign to exercise extreme caution." ---Allie the Chihuahua http://www.dogster.com/?41063 ---Mönica the Kitty http://www.catster.com/?57596
Akc rules though well meaning, do not supercede the right to contract. And if someone perpetrates a fraud then they can find themselves in a civil court house. My fear is that someone is selling stolen dogs and blaming it on the deceased.
I did a google search, and found the link to terrific pets. There is ever possibilty that you may have been scammed and there are no AKC papers. People that talk on the forum do not usually check the dogs for sale. There are several of us on here that have been scammed, but not by this person.
braveheart7, what are you asking us to help you do? Find this person you purchased you bulldogs from? What is their name? where do they live? Is this add familiar? Breed: Bulldog (Breed Info) Age: 4 and 6 years old Price: $1200.00 Ad Views*: 41251 We have a female and male for sale. $1200 each or $2000 for the pair. Contact us for a 2 for 1 special on these dogs. These are both akc registered. Contact Information: charles rice jasper, AL 35504 (United States) 205-384-1324 You mentioned buying them from Alabama and this is the only one on the for sale page. ltlgto
If I understand correctly, she purchased the dogs from someone on this site who told her they were being sold because the owner Karen ? was deceased. She got the dogs but never the papers. Now she is worried that the dogs are stolen or something and is trying to track down something about the person who they told her the dogs had belonged to. Does that make sense? I think it's great that she's concerned about that. Too many people wouldn't even give it a thought. I just don't know how to find out what she needs to know.
Call AKC with Karen's full name and address and see if she had these dogs registered. If she did tell them she died and you now own them and how can you get the papers into your name. I don't know how that works when the person dies and they can't sign over the papers. The executor of her estate might have to sign them. Good luck
No, thats not exactly whats going on. Sorry I will try to be clear without saying anything innapropriate. She had problems with the papers because the previous owner had died(in Illinois) and left her charge of some 35 bulldogs. But the lawyers were involoved and thought she had the dogs, she did not have the papers though AKC was working on it. I trusted her to send the papers. But I have received no papers and I have had a chance to talk to others she has dealt with and it seems the truth and her are not intimate freinds. Another party drove from Michigan to Alabama in a rented truck to buy some bullies from her last weekend. But returned home in an empty trruck because the Alabama woman could not produce papers. I dont know whats going on here but I will find out. Any help is appreciated.
Braveheart............Some of what you said sounds kind of familar, thinking you may have been scammed, but considering the amount of puppies involved sounds like she may very well have been a broker. That is pretty much what the guy was that scammed me. Just by what I have read I doubt that any of the puppies have papers. My experience with the AKC is that they do not willingly give information. If you had the AKC numbers for the puppies parents they might tell you something, but it sounds like to me there are probably a lot of parents involved. Have you checked with the Attorney General's office to see if there have been other complaints? When I did a google search and was lead back to Terrific pets I found the same one as ltlgto mentioned a few post earlier.
Just out of curiosity what in gods name were you shipping 20 bulldogs to CA for? And why would you ever want to buy 6-10 of them other than to "turn a quick profit"? I am sorry you got screwed if that is what happened but I just am not following why you needed so many bulldogs? It sounds cut and dry to me. You got some dogs that someone is missing. Have you tried to see if they are chipped? Sorry if I sound cold but the whole story seems wierd. Renting trucks to go get bulldogs like they were some sort of commodity is odd in my book. I feel bad for all these dogs, and the horses if that is true as well.
I want you to reread what you wrote and ask yourself, who gave you the authority to insinuate yourself into a position of moral judge over others. Who cares why I buy 6-10 or a million dogs. I have not broken any law. Just because you wouldnt doesnt mean everyone who does is wrong. The person rented a truck because they wouldnt fit in the trunk of her car(dahh). And in case you did not know, Dogs are commodities. To ignore the obvious is very odd. And if the dogs are stolen they will be returned to the owner at my loss if necessary. I dont think you are cold but you sound like one of those misdirected people who think animals are equal to humans or if a dog has mud on his foot he has been abused. The point here is a potential criminal and/or immoral situation that needs to be stopped. Dont persecute the victem.
Actually to be honest you completely misread the point of my post. I was merely pointing out the oddness of the whole situation. I was questioning why you would want the number of dogs you wanted with a clear hypothesis as to your reasons. I do however totally disagree with the whole dogs are a commodity thing. And I am going to venture a guess that the vast majority of people on this forum will take exception to the statement you made. In my original post I wasn't calling into question your ethics so to speak, although I think I was able to read between the lines quite well. With your response it's clear to me that you don't have the health and welfare of the dogs, or even where they end up in mind. The almighty dollar is clearly the motivation behind your interest in these dogs. So with that said I think I can pass judgment upon your intention and reasons behind why and how many of these "commodity dogs" you want to buy. You are the one that made your intentions clear for all to see. Again sorry you got scammed but thems the breaks when you’re dealing in wholesale dogs as you clearly are. Like I said my heart goes out to the dogs. Ps. A muddy foot just means a muddy carpet, not an abused dog. :) Edit: Ok after re-reading what you wrote I am dumbfounded at your idiocy. You are obviously someone who uses whatever means they deem fit to turn a buck. I find this appaling and you to be a disgrace. I think it is my business as a dog owner and a breed advocate if you are shipping dogs wholesale and are rubbing it in peoples faces. The fact of the matter is, what you are doing does nothing at all to advance the breed or dogs in general. You are if anything a supporter and perpetuator of the puppy mill mentality that runs rampant throughout the world. In short people like you make me sick. /rant off.
There may be someone out there selling stolen dogs and speaking lies about someone who cannot defend herself because she is dead and instead of helping you use it as an opportunity to get on a soap box and pontificate your version of morality and make groundless accusations at someone you dont even know? I came here for help and you attacked me? You dont know who I am? You dont know if I have 100 dogs or none at all? You dont know if I am black or white; american or Iraqi? You dont know if I am 17 or 72? Whats clear about you is somehow you believe you are the moral voice for all but amount to a Mickey-Mouse Miltant. I am an Israelite for you information and its my inheritance to take care of the creatures that my God put here with me. I do not mistreat animals and I resent your hostile invective. Are you freinds of the woman in Alabama??? People who mistreat animals make me angry but what you are doing is much worse. I am beginning to wonder what kind of forum this is??? You are the most unfreindly person I have ever encountered. I am certainly willing to forgive if you are so inclined. Your attack was far too intense, either tone it down or leave me alone.
I'm confused...you said "I was contacted by a woman in Alabama who wanted me to ship 20 or so bulldogs to California." Why would someone contact you to ship the dogs? Why did the person ship the dogs themselves? How did they contact you if you aren't in the business of shipping dogs from state to state? I don't blame the others for thinking something "fishy" is going on. It does sound strange. If I understand this you were contacted out of the blue by someone you don't know, to ship dogs that you have nothing to do with to a different state? Then something goes wrong so you go there and wound up buying 2 of the dogs? Then someone else you know takes a truck there to pick up dogs and for what purpose, we don't know...then leaves without those dogs and you wonder why you don't have "papers"? I think no matter what you are out of luck about the papers...and most people don't look at dogs as a commodity....that is a scary thought...sounds like a puppymiller's thoughts on animals...so you can see why "we" would think that all this isn't on the up and up...